I have walked/hiked a couple of times in Spain, on their pilgrimage routes. (Nowadays, I guess most people there are not pilgrims, but rather those who enjoy walking and hiking.) Although I did go to Spain to walk and talk, when I read Dan Wang's newsletter, I immediately remembered my experiences there. Walking, at least for me, is mentally stimulating. It allows you to get away from everyday noise, don't have to think about the little daily hassles. In my experience, walking 15 km in a day is on the low end. It's not challenging at all. You can have numerous breaks and a relaxed pace. For instance, in Spain, it’s easy to stop in a village for a coffee or a sandwich. I you enter a village (as I did in Spain), you can have a cup of coffee or a sandwich. I'm not sure about the US, but I would suggest taking routes that are already popular with hikers/walkers. They typically require less preparation, offer better infrastructure.
Second this based on experience of one of my daughters on the Camino. The highlight for her was the conversations with very diverse groups of people over a month on the trail. She became fast friends with people 50 years older than her and from many different countries and backgrounds. We met her at the end of the trail and got to meet some of her fellow piligrims. What a joy! Hoping to repeat the experience once I retire.
If you want a linear trail i.e. point A to point B you'd want something like the AT, but it lacks quality accommodations- maybe the Shenandoah or Harper's Ferry areas.
Your other option is to find a hub as base camp and have daily hikes. Yellowstone Lodge and then day hikes/loops which bring you back to the lodge would solve the issue(or take a van to specific trailheads). My guess is there are State or Nat'l parks in the northeast which fill the bill and have relatively flat hikes.
One thing that the organizers (Kevin Kelly and Craig Mod) have noted is that it's difficult to do this walk almost anywhere in the US. If you want to stay in motels — rather than pitching tents — it's difficult finding a walkable route that has accommodations at regular intervals.
Perhaps it's best not to overthink group selection. A set of interlocutors optimized for you might not be optimized for each other. Anyone who would do this sort of trip is already selected for most of the right attributes.
I agree that you don't want too rugged of a walk. That's one reason we walked relatively short distances. Our food was not mostly high end. But having a satisfying meal at the end of the day rather than a burger helped, I think, to stimulate conversation.
Lastly consider Moab, Utah. Hundreds of trails. Fun town. This is the best place if you want to feel like a kid again. And the geology is incredible, practically a transcendental experience. Stay at the Element in Moab. Marriot hotels are the easiest to book for parties of five with kitchens. No need to eat at restaurants every night.
Nearby highlights would be the Shakespeare Festival in Cedar City, and the Narrows in Zion. The Narrows is incredible; it’s an international destination. Want to feel like a kid again, hike the Narrows!
Fly into Salt Lake City, visit the museum and visitors center of the local church, take the tour of BYU and drive south to Moab. Optional trips to Cedar City and Zion.
I assume you are not considering a walk and talk outside the US.
I'm more used to urban walks and find them very stimulating. Walking in foreign cities with lots of cafés is particularly enjoyable since you can stop anywhere you want and indulge in some people watching.
I'm >70, so your constraints on exertion sound about right. Location depends on season. To get started, probably some established longer trail that is already well-provisioned for thru-hikers and cyclists. Great Allegheny Passage? Confederation Trail on Prince Edward Island? I would imagine that the nature of the activity would lead to self-selection for acceptable conversants, but I could be wrong. Is a charismatic leader needed? I'm sure I would try it if the stars lined up.
+1 for the GAP trail btw Cumberland and Pittsburgh. I've supported a bike trip along that, and I think you could find lodging at reasonable walking distances.
Final suggestion would be an Apple-Vision -Pro-linked group walk with each of us walking on treadmills from home. Dining options not as fun though. But you get to keep the Apple Vision Pro at the end. Could be the start of Arnold’s weekly NBU Walk and Talk. I’m serious about this.
Sounds great, tho 10 days w/o spouse, in order to have other interesting conversations, is an issue. I would expect any 70+- mile stretch on the multi-state Appalachian trail would be good on the East, and any big National Park in the West would have 7+ trails.
Won’t have a lot of civilization without cars, which means more focus on your thoughts and those you’re with.
I would think a base camp / retreat in a rural location would fit the bill and easier to find than point-to-point venues. An AirBnb or VRBO home or two with access to hiking trails would serve. Shared cooking and wash-up could be opportunities for conversation without being physically taxing or expensive. There are several locations in W.Va., PA, and VA that meet this description, i.e. in or near the Appalachians, rustic but not too rugged.
Near here, I'd suggest winecountry - did a half marathon up near Santa Ynez CA, very pretty, not a lot of traffic. some hills. Surely a beach/ocean 5 day path could be organized and probably not a lot of hills. You could also do Santa Barbara - base in town, pick different hike each day. France: I'd do Brittany/Normandy near Mont St Michel. New Zealand: I'd do Abel Tasman National Park! Aaand a friend of mine did a cycling trip like this with an 'assist' type bicycle in the French Alps. That got me thinking that instead of walking, 'assist' bikes might allow less fit folks to participate comfortably. Possible to have conversations in 2 or 3?
The one thing I'd not want on this kind of trip are people who always talk, never listen - I find it's important to allow for a back and forth.
I love the idea. It seems England, with free right of passage, would be perfect. Not sure where else would be as good.
You are correct about the difficulty of walking and talking on more strenuous trails. We did Salkantay to Machu Pichu and I'd say much of it is not good for walk and talk. Another option, which might be especially useful in good old USA, is to do different loops from one or two locations.
The other area I can recommend is the Owyhee Mountains 60 minutes south of Boise, Idaho. Start in Celebration Park, cross the Snake River and hike all day, along the river. This is a very special spot. It contains dozens of pictographs where native tribes wintered hundreds or thousands of years ago. Then hike the fire roads up to Silver City where there is a “non-abandoned ghost town.” Many other trails too easily found in local hiking books.
Also, Boise has perfect hiking trails within walking distance of Downtown; both single track and fire road. Could walk for days on the trails, leading all the way from Boise to the top mountains, and Bogus Basin. Boise is super, clean, safe and most importantly (Idaho) ranks high on the freedom index. :)
Boise also has a beautiful river flowing through Downtown that is extremely clean. Families float it all summer long. The walking and bike paths along the side of the river go on for tens of miles from Eagle to Lucky Peak Reservoir. Very safe. No homeless people. Mix of shade and sun. Restaurants along the way.
If you really want to go all out on location I recommend the Andes about 4 hours south of Santiago. Take the train from Santiago to Chillan. Buy your supplies in Chillan, then shuttle as a group to the foothills of the Andes. I did this with a group of 30 through the Sierra Institute when I was an undergraduate at UC Santa Cruz. That part of the world is unique in that there are almost no mosquitoes, yellow jackets and most importantly, no bears! Just jaguars, but those only eat kids.
The best part of doing a backpacking trip like this is cooking food over a wood-fueled fire, and sitting around the fire, days away from civilization. Also the stars are incredible. There’s a reason Giant Magellan Telescope is being built in the Andes.
I plan to take my family there one of these winters. Other benefits of Chile. It’s safe, clean and ranks high on the freedom index.
After Chillan, the group can split up. Some might venture up to Machu Picchu, others to the beach and others south to the Lake District.
The second best part of doing a group backpacking trip like this is the group dynamics. If you want to experience our innate tribal tendencies, a trip like this will reveal it to you; in a good way. Primate-like differences between men and women show themselves; alpha-males emerge and compete.
Water is safe to drink directly out of streams with zero filtering or chemical treatment. And there are vaqueros living in the foothills that are living in the almost like the 18th century.
Portugal has great locations for this with wide variety of themes (Mountain, Beach, Pilgrimage, ...). If anyone wants to organize something there please drop me a note at pedro.ramos@somarcap.com
I have walked/hiked a couple of times in Spain, on their pilgrimage routes. (Nowadays, I guess most people there are not pilgrims, but rather those who enjoy walking and hiking.) Although I did go to Spain to walk and talk, when I read Dan Wang's newsletter, I immediately remembered my experiences there. Walking, at least for me, is mentally stimulating. It allows you to get away from everyday noise, don't have to think about the little daily hassles. In my experience, walking 15 km in a day is on the low end. It's not challenging at all. You can have numerous breaks and a relaxed pace. For instance, in Spain, it’s easy to stop in a village for a coffee or a sandwich. I you enter a village (as I did in Spain), you can have a cup of coffee or a sandwich. I'm not sure about the US, but I would suggest taking routes that are already popular with hikers/walkers. They typically require less preparation, offer better infrastructure.
Second this based on experience of one of my daughters on the Camino. The highlight for her was the conversations with very diverse groups of people over a month on the trail. She became fast friends with people 50 years older than her and from many different countries and backgrounds. We met her at the end of the trail and got to meet some of her fellow piligrims. What a joy! Hoping to repeat the experience once I retire.
If you want a linear trail i.e. point A to point B you'd want something like the AT, but it lacks quality accommodations- maybe the Shenandoah or Harper's Ferry areas.
Your other option is to find a hub as base camp and have daily hikes. Yellowstone Lodge and then day hikes/loops which bring you back to the lodge would solve the issue(or take a van to specific trailheads). My guess is there are State or Nat'l parks in the northeast which fill the bill and have relatively flat hikes.
thanks, Arnold, for picking up on my post.
One thing that the organizers (Kevin Kelly and Craig Mod) have noted is that it's difficult to do this walk almost anywhere in the US. If you want to stay in motels — rather than pitching tents — it's difficult finding a walkable route that has accommodations at regular intervals.
Perhaps it's best not to overthink group selection. A set of interlocutors optimized for you might not be optimized for each other. Anyone who would do this sort of trip is already selected for most of the right attributes.
I agree that you don't want too rugged of a walk. That's one reason we walked relatively short distances. Our food was not mostly high end. But having a satisfying meal at the end of the day rather than a burger helped, I think, to stimulate conversation.
Lastly consider Moab, Utah. Hundreds of trails. Fun town. This is the best place if you want to feel like a kid again. And the geology is incredible, practically a transcendental experience. Stay at the Element in Moab. Marriot hotels are the easiest to book for parties of five with kitchens. No need to eat at restaurants every night.
Nearby highlights would be the Shakespeare Festival in Cedar City, and the Narrows in Zion. The Narrows is incredible; it’s an international destination. Want to feel like a kid again, hike the Narrows!
Fly into Salt Lake City, visit the museum and visitors center of the local church, take the tour of BYU and drive south to Moab. Optional trips to Cedar City and Zion.
I assume you are not considering a walk and talk outside the US.
I'm more used to urban walks and find them very stimulating. Walking in foreign cities with lots of cafés is particularly enjoyable since you can stop anywhere you want and indulge in some people watching.
It was run by Kevin Kelly: https://kk.org/thetechnium/files/2023/12/howtowalkandtalk.pdf
I'm >70, so your constraints on exertion sound about right. Location depends on season. To get started, probably some established longer trail that is already well-provisioned for thru-hikers and cyclists. Great Allegheny Passage? Confederation Trail on Prince Edward Island? I would imagine that the nature of the activity would lead to self-selection for acceptable conversants, but I could be wrong. Is a charismatic leader needed? I'm sure I would try it if the stars lined up.
+1 for the GAP trail btw Cumberland and Pittsburgh. I've supported a bike trip along that, and I think you could find lodging at reasonable walking distances.
Final suggestion would be an Apple-Vision -Pro-linked group walk with each of us walking on treadmills from home. Dining options not as fun though. But you get to keep the Apple Vision Pro at the end. Could be the start of Arnold’s weekly NBU Walk and Talk. I’m serious about this.
https://arnoldkling.substack.com/p/white-paper-for-network-based-higher
Interesting to me that comments are so much more about "walk" than "talk." I love "Talk and Walks." Our variant has been:
6 college friends meet up for a few days in a new location.
The walks/hikes tend to be 1-on-1 convo. You sort of rotate guys, perhaps 30 to 60 minutes, ad hoc.
The meals are group chats.
I need introvert recharge time sometimes....even 30 minutes of my headphones goes a long way.
Sounds great, tho 10 days w/o spouse, in order to have other interesting conversations, is an issue. I would expect any 70+- mile stretch on the multi-state Appalachian trail would be good on the East, and any big National Park in the West would have 7+ trails.
Won’t have a lot of civilization without cars, which means more focus on your thoughts and those you’re with.
I would think a base camp / retreat in a rural location would fit the bill and easier to find than point-to-point venues. An AirBnb or VRBO home or two with access to hiking trails would serve. Shared cooking and wash-up could be opportunities for conversation without being physically taxing or expensive. There are several locations in W.Va., PA, and VA that meet this description, i.e. in or near the Appalachians, rustic but not too rugged.
Near here, I'd suggest winecountry - did a half marathon up near Santa Ynez CA, very pretty, not a lot of traffic. some hills. Surely a beach/ocean 5 day path could be organized and probably not a lot of hills. You could also do Santa Barbara - base in town, pick different hike each day. France: I'd do Brittany/Normandy near Mont St Michel. New Zealand: I'd do Abel Tasman National Park! Aaand a friend of mine did a cycling trip like this with an 'assist' type bicycle in the French Alps. That got me thinking that instead of walking, 'assist' bikes might allow less fit folks to participate comfortably. Possible to have conversations in 2 or 3?
The one thing I'd not want on this kind of trip are people who always talk, never listen - I find it's important to allow for a back and forth.
I love the idea. It seems England, with free right of passage, would be perfect. Not sure where else would be as good.
You are correct about the difficulty of walking and talking on more strenuous trails. We did Salkantay to Machu Pichu and I'd say much of it is not good for walk and talk. Another option, which might be especially useful in good old USA, is to do different loops from one or two locations.
The other area I can recommend is the Owyhee Mountains 60 minutes south of Boise, Idaho. Start in Celebration Park, cross the Snake River and hike all day, along the river. This is a very special spot. It contains dozens of pictographs where native tribes wintered hundreds or thousands of years ago. Then hike the fire roads up to Silver City where there is a “non-abandoned ghost town.” Many other trails too easily found in local hiking books.
Also, Boise has perfect hiking trails within walking distance of Downtown; both single track and fire road. Could walk for days on the trails, leading all the way from Boise to the top mountains, and Bogus Basin. Boise is super, clean, safe and most importantly (Idaho) ranks high on the freedom index. :)
Boise also has a beautiful river flowing through Downtown that is extremely clean. Families float it all summer long. The walking and bike paths along the side of the river go on for tens of miles from Eagle to Lucky Peak Reservoir. Very safe. No homeless people. Mix of shade and sun. Restaurants along the way.
Best time to visit Idaho is fall and spring.
https://visitidaho.org/things-to-do/natural-attractions/owyhee-mountains/
If you really want to go all out on location I recommend the Andes about 4 hours south of Santiago. Take the train from Santiago to Chillan. Buy your supplies in Chillan, then shuttle as a group to the foothills of the Andes. I did this with a group of 30 through the Sierra Institute when I was an undergraduate at UC Santa Cruz. That part of the world is unique in that there are almost no mosquitoes, yellow jackets and most importantly, no bears! Just jaguars, but those only eat kids.
The best part of doing a backpacking trip like this is cooking food over a wood-fueled fire, and sitting around the fire, days away from civilization. Also the stars are incredible. There’s a reason Giant Magellan Telescope is being built in the Andes.
https://giantmagellan.org
I plan to take my family there one of these winters. Other benefits of Chile. It’s safe, clean and ranks high on the freedom index.
After Chillan, the group can split up. Some might venture up to Machu Picchu, others to the beach and others south to the Lake District.
The second best part of doing a group backpacking trip like this is the group dynamics. If you want to experience our innate tribal tendencies, a trip like this will reveal it to you; in a good way. Primate-like differences between men and women show themselves; alpha-males emerge and compete.
Water is safe to drink directly out of streams with zero filtering or chemical treatment. And there are vaqueros living in the foothills that are living in the almost like the 18th century.
Check it out!
Dr. Tony Povilitis was our guide on that trip.
https://lifenetnature.org/about/profiles/
Chile gave up on freedom, Argentina gave up on socialism, at least the President voters did.
The long term trend in Chile are still better than other countries in South America.
Portugal has great locations for this with wide variety of themes (Mountain, Beach, Pilgrimage, ...). If anyone wants to organize something there please drop me a note at pedro.ramos@somarcap.com